“I chuckle after they name me a Marxist,” he tells me. Pepe Mujica. “I'm not a Marxist, I'm a Stoic.” And what does that imply? “It’s the residing gentle of bags, the hassle to domesticate a contented prudence, making use of that outdated precept: 'Nothing in extra'…”
I solely have to go searching to see that he applies the precept fairly rigorously. We’re within the countryside, half an hour from Montevideo, speaking within the kitchen of the small farm the place the ex-guerrilla, ex-prisoner, former president of Uruguay (2010-2015) and, on the age of 88, the world's favourite grandfather left . , dwell..
The kitchen is your lounge and your eating room. The one concession to luxurious, or the one exception to sobriety, could be the gathering of bottles of whiskey, gin, rum, vodka, tequila and mezcal that adorn the cabinets behind the wood chair through which he sits.
Sustain the stoicism and light-weight packing, I say. “And, deep down, it's a matter of freedom, as a result of If I undergo necessity, I’m not free. The purpose is to have time to spend on the issues we take pleasure in.”
And what do you want? “Strolling within the subject. “I just like the countryside as a result of I speak to myself there.” With myself? “Sure, I spent seven years alone in jail. There aren’t any books. I had nothing to do. Nothing. And I needed to be taught to speak to the one inside me. And you understand what he advised me? He greeted me rather a lot, advised me that when he was very small he had been very loopy. However the good factor is that I had learn rather a lot after which I began fascinated about my books”.
“I discovered to benefit from the inside, to grasp that the one fantastic factor there may be for each individual is to have been born, to dwell this journey of life. There may be nothing larger than the chance to dwell. Perceive?”.
And make good use of your time, I recommend.
Former Uruguayan president José Mujica and his spouse Lucía Topolansky, in a picture from 2023. Picture: AFPMujica, trying like an outdated teddy bear, is alive and smiling. He likes to speak. So clear that when the ethical energy of his presidency put Uruguay on the world map like by no means earlier than, He doesn’t converse with anger in regards to the years of navy dictatorship what occurred in jail Quite the opposite, evidently the expertise has strengthened him. Attentive to each phrase uttered by the oracle of the pampas, grateful to have the ability to share time with him in his lair, I suggest to alter the topic from philosophy to politics.
“Go on!” he solutions me.
In contrast to the shrinking that characterizes political discourse in virtually each different Western nation, not excluding boisterous neighbors Argentina and Brazil, all is respect, calm, consensus and peace. And the details show this. Within the rating of the UN and different worldwide organizations, Uruguay is second within the Americas, solely after Canada, in democracy, transparency and safety. How have they managed to distance themselves from the madding crowd in such a manner?
“I consider,” says Mujica, “that to start with it’s about our historical past.” In 1910, Uruguay had a undertaking that, utilizing modern language, we might name social democracy. Got here in like a cruise ship, stayed and anchored. There was a era of individuals led by President José Batlle y Ordoñez who modeled some issues – similar to public help, similar to girls's rights – that coloured the historical past of Uruguay. To the purpose that the Swedes got here to check it and transplanted issues from right here.
─Are you telling me that the favored Nordic mannequin of democracy was impressed by Uruguay?
─They took issues from right here, for certain.
─Issues that by no means left right here?
─Aside from the interval of the navy dictatorship, from 1973 to 1985, no. Look, consensus was imposed in such a manner that we leftists can’t be so leftist as a result of historical past mediates us. Not even these on the fitting. Right here comes a right-wing authorities and can’t abandon social insurance policies. That barbarism that occurs as we speak in Argentina: no, no. It doesn't even happen to them.
Former Uruguayan president José Pepe Mujica, at his residence in Rincón del Cerro. Picture: EFE─ Will you seek advice from the social austerity insurance policies of President Javier Milei?
─ Sure, It's horrible what occurs there. However that's what occurs when individuals get fed up. Milei is an extremist and voting for him is a symptom of desperation.
─Due to that completely underdeveloped economic system?
─And due to the large corruption in any respect ranges
─However how did you keep away from catching the Argentine virus, having them so shut? And never just for the financial chaos and corruption, but additionally for the extreme polarization, the well-known division…
─It's simply that Argentina is outlined by the phenomenon of Peronism, which isn’t an ideology, it’s a faith. A mystic. Peronism is the consequence of a historic circumstance: Argentina was a really wealthy nation, however with one social injustice of the massive whore. After which Perón reaches his 40s and begins distributing and distributing. He remained as God, after all. And this isn’t forgotten. It was engraved within the tradition of a giant a part of the Argentine individuals. Then they made a large number. Then all the things occurred, however that reminiscence remained and Peronism stays there. It continues there…
Let's discuss faith, I say. One thing a few of his countrymen have advised me is that one more reason why Uruguay is an oasis of civilization is the atheism that defines it. What do you assume?
“And, sure, together with that of social democracy, the thought of separation of church and state was created right here greater than 100 years in the past. At the moment just one p.c of the inhabitants is a practitioner, by far the bottom price in Latin America. Have a look at President Batlle y Ordoñez, there within the 1920s. He was a journalist and president and in his articles I’ve at all times written the phrase “god” in lowercase letters, by no means “God” in capital letters“.
─ Are you in opposition to faith?
─ Properly, I feel monotheistic religions have harmed humanity of the soiled mom. They’ve generated deep-seated bigotry and intolerance that extends into the political world.
─However do many rely on the consolation that faith provides them, particularly in poorer nations?
─Alright. I perceive completely. There are about 4200 religions on the planet and greater than 60% of the world's inhabitants believes in one thing. No, it isn’t a think about throwing it away. No no no. And furthermore, though religions had been utilized by energy to oppress, additionally they helped to dwell with some hope for what they didn’t know they might eat tomorrow. I perceive that the subject is difficult. Religions can foster fanaticism, however they will also be a hindrance.
In an hour and a half we went from philosophy, to politics, to faith and its paradoxes. I flip off the recorder, I rise up, Mujica will get up and we are saying goodbye. I'm about to show round and begin down a muddy path to the automotive that may take me again to Montevideo when Mujica calls out: “However, brother! I didn't give you a drink! Sit down. I selected one thing from what I’ve right here.”
I survey the providing, as plentiful as that of a New York cocktail bar, and level to an unopened bottle of mezcal.
“Seems good,” I say.
“You may be certain of that. “The Mexican ambassador introduced it to me.”
Open the bottle and fill the glasses. After some time I fill them once more. We take pleasure in, with the recorder at all times off, what he calls pleased prudence. That is Uruguay, the place Mujica jogs my memory that the primary World Cup was held, and for a great a part of the hour and a half I spend in his kitchen, we speak – after all – about soccer, the one subject through which his compatriots. lose their composure, they usually behave with the identical abandon, or extra, than the remainder of mankind.